Work Shop Time-Share System

[BeauV]

I'm not certain where to put this, but a bunch of sailing friends are getting together to join this outfit as a group. It is a club time-share sort of thing that gives one access to heaps of tools and great stuff. Sadly, there isn't a shop in the PNW yet, but it looks as though it's growing fast. I'm certainly considering joining. There's a bit of a ponzi smell to the business model, but I don't need to worry about that as I won't live long enough for them to run out of new customers.

It would be so much cheaper to rent vs own all those tools. And with this place there are folks to actually teach one how to use them, vs loosing a few fingers and toes along the way.

Here's the web site: http://techshop.ws/index.html

[Charlie]

Beau,

Techshop has been around for a while, and I recall that they expanded to Portland and RTP. We looked at starting something similar in the Northeast, but the numbers didnt work. I can't figure out how their business model is sustainable, given the huge amount of capex versus membership fee. Maybe you're right, it gets by on Ponzi.

There is a serious lack of skills among kids these days, so I would love to see something like this become popular. I spent a large portion of my youth in my dad's basement shop, running metal lathes and mills when I was still in grade school. But even then, the disposable culture mentality was already beginning to take hold in the US. I'm amazed at the number of successful guys I know, who pride themselves on NOT knowing how to use tools and fix things. I guess they view the ability to hire someone else to do things for them as a mark of success.

One bright spot is the burgeoning maker movement, which manifests itself in things like Techshop, Mythbusters, and various artisan manufacturing companies. Lets hope that continues.

Charlie

[VALIS]

Techshop -- it that the outfit that Michael M. has been telling me about? It sounds like fun, but agree about the sustainability question.

I've really turned around on the whole "Make" movement. At first I was completely underwhelmed -- it seemed like the kind of stuff I was doing in Junior High, only now by adults. Pretty amateurish, most of it.

But eventually I realized that it didn't matter. It is great that people, any people, any age, are teaching themselves how to build things. We have an entire generation or two who are passive technology consumers, and anything that gets people to try creating for themselves is great. Some of the Makers are doing sophisticated, interesting things, and even the ones who are just now learning how to switch a LED on and off are taking a big step. I honestly think that knowing how to create, rather than just consume, is a huge benefit to all of us. And, it's fun.

Yes, I know that there are many ways to create -- creation doesn't have to physically manifest itself in nuts and bolts and wires and solder. But physical interaction with our world is important.

[BeauV]

Paul,

I completely agree that building stuff matters. I hate that fewer and fewer people build things - anything. One of my big interests in the PT-11 is actually the building of it, in addition to it being a great looking boat. When I've built/restored/saved something like a car or boat it's greatly satisfying. Going to the dealership and simply picking out a car is fine for our SUV but has the emotional content of a buying a new toaster - rebuilding the Morgan from a box of parts and hearing it run the first time, that is something I'll never forget.

Beau

[Soñadora]

I used to think that kids were losing 'skills' too. But some interesting things to note:

In most high schools, kids can take engineering classes. These are way beyond the drafting class I went to in my day. These classes have sophisticated 3D modeling software, analysis and rapid prototyping equipment. These are elective classes and usually have a waiting list.

While many of the things machinists used to do by eye are now done by computer, the level of expertise to build things in a machine shop has required a much broader skill set and much higher intelligence than it used to. I honestly believe this is why there is a trend to bring back manufacturing to the U.S. I heard an interesting commentary from a manufacturer who used to have things built in China. He moved production to the U.S. citing that quality control and volume control were extremely difficult. The shop he used in China did most things by hand and had a large staff of machinists. He moved production to the U.S. where most of his manufacturing could be automated and staff cut significantly. This gave him flexible production runs and much greater control over quality. I am baffled why the U.S. manufacturing output is such a big secret. Maybe it's just a Minnesota thing, but there is a shortage of employees in that space.

I may agree to some extent that there seems to be a lot of slugs in the current youth pool. I've also observed some incredibly brilliant stuff that I never would have dreamed of back when I was in high school. Making things has been a hallmark of U.S. ingenuity. I have faith that we will see an increase in creativity and 'making' things.

Personally, one dream I have is to have a big garage where I can rebuild old VWs and Porsches. I love working on cars, just don't have the time. My Porsche is currently sitting on a lift in my garage waiting for me to replace the coolant temp sensor. I put it on the lift in October and haven't had the time.

[VALIS]

I'm sure it's to some extent a regional thing, and you will find pockets of enthusiasm everywhere. (Enthusiasm is way more important than skill, talent, ability, etc. Without enthusiasm the rest doesn't develop, and doesn't matter.) I do miss "the old days" when my friends and I all had subscriptions to Popular Electronics magazine

[LarryHoward]

I used to think that kids were losing 'skills' too. But some interesting things to note:

In most high schools, kids can take engineering classes. These are way beyond the drafting class I went to in my day. These classes have sophisticated 3D modeling software, analysis and rapid prototyping equipment. These are elective classes and usually have a waiting list.


I may agree to some extent that there seems to be a lot of slugs in the current youth pool. I've also observed some incredibly brilliant stuff that I never would have dreamed of back when I was in high school. Making things has been a hallmark of U.S. ingenuity. I have faith that we will see an increase in creativity and 'making' things.

Rick,

I'm with you 100% on the engineering classes. There's an increased focus on STEM education, usually established in one of the lower performing High Schools. Unfortunately, it's usually a single entry, 4 year program and transfer students can't enter part way through and the administration (at least here) seems to think they've done all they need to do and generally ignore STEM oriented students not actually in the program. One of the professional organizations I'm part of hosted the Dean of UM James Clark School of Engineering. The school system arranged a field trip for the formal STEM classes to attend his presentation. Students taking engineering courses at the other two high schools were not notified of the visit.

I see some really energetic high school students involved in robotics, science fairs, etc. and a fair number of the "slugs" are writing iPhone aps and at least one is coding for World of Warcraft in his spare time. When my son is home from college, he hangs around with the local car nuts. Their discussions are similar to mine back in the day except instead of synchronizing Webers, cam grinds and ignition advance curves, they talk about turbos, superchargers, reflashing ECUs
in addition to intakes, exhausts, suspension mods and tires.

Plenty of couch potatoes but a lot of smart, motivated kids as well.

[BeauV]

All,

I have found a LOT of young folks working with really advanced technologies to build what they want. One of the kids my daughter's age dropped out of college and went to work for Garret building turbos, he's also a top flight motorcycle racer in his free time. I think that the sort of technology has changed a lot. When I was a kid I built radios with my Dad, who was W6EQE, we wrenched VWs into dune buggies, and dropped a Corvette V8 into his '54 Austin Healy That WOKE UP the neighbors!!

Now, the kids my kid's age are controlling home made drones with Raspberry Pi computers and taking pictures from near-space with it. You should see what a "radio" controlled sailboat can do with a Pi computer controls the sheets while another one tries to steer the optimum VMG. These kids are already beating some of the hand-driven "yachts" and it's only a matter of time until they are simply much faster.

Have a look at this from the NY Times today: http://www.nytimes.com/2013/01/31/techn ... .html?_r=0

Oddly, I ended up being a software engineer because I was working at Barient when the first NC Milling machine got delivered and they needed someone to run it. The older machinists wouldn't touch the thing, and couldn't do the trig to write the codes for it, so I got the job. It changed my life and is exactly what's going on as new technology arrives now and the young kids take to it while many of us old duffers don't.

Beau

[Soñadora]

back to your OP Beau, I knew I'd seen 'Tech Shop' somewhere before. I keep getting e-mails from them. I must have signed up for it at some point.

I like the idea. Not sure it's financially viable, but it's a pretty cool concept. It may work as a co-op. It reminds me of Freewheel bike here in the Twin Cities. You sign up for memebership and you can use all the tools in their shop to work on bikes. In fact, I think you even have to commit to a week's worth of work. Not sure about that though.

[Cherie320]

That is a very interesting idea. Proximity seems to be the issue. Does sound like fun. Pat

[Olaf Hart]

There is a "men's sheds" movement in Oz, to help get retired men out of their houses and network, share skills, mentor young guys when are interested in learning skills.

One thing I have noticed is that folks in isolated commnities are much more self reliant. In Tassie everyone has a workshop, and self reliance is the norm. On Bruny Island most of the folks I know have built their own homes. Completely the opposite when I lived in Sydney.

[BeauV]

There is a movement to Man Cave style shops and garages around here. Motorheads/boatbuilders/bikenuts are putting in lifts, hoists and cranes along with big-screen TV, Keg holder/chiller, BBQ grill with hood so it can be used inside when it's raining, a couple of couches and some video games. I have to admit, my garage is carpeted and it is much nicer to wrench on the Morgan while laying on a carpet. Some examples:

[kimbottles]

How could you possibly get anything done in those clean garages???

[Cherie320]

Years ago, my dad told me about a garage he visited in Colorado. It had carpeting on the floor. Well, it was several layers of old wool carpet that kept the poor mechanic off the cold damp earth floor. Oh, how times have changed. Pat

[Soñadora]

"A Car Lover's Nirvana"

http://www.topspeed.com/cars/car-news/v ... 10923.html

In the summer, the first saturday of the month they do Cars 'n Coffee where anyone with a 'cool car' can park in the paddock surrounding the buildings. I get to go down and park with all the 'real' Porsches and feel special.

My car is in this picture

[JoeP]

Yeah I see it. It' the burgundy 944 right over there. Right?

[LarryHoward]

But you have to be in Minneapolis.

[Charlie]

There is a movement to Man Cave style shops and garages around here. Motorheads/boatbuilders/bikenuts are putting in lifts, hoists and cranes along with big-screen TV, Keg holder/chiller, BBQ grill with hood so it can be used inside when it's raining, a couple of couches and some video games. I have to admit, my garage is carpeted and it is much nicer to wrench on the Morgan while laying on a carpet. Some examples:

I like the last one best.

Keg coolers in the shop? One wonders about the accident rate of "lemme just finish this beer before firing up the table saw..."

[LarryHoward]

There is a movement to Man Cave style shops and garages around here. Motorheads/boatbuilders/bikenuts are putting in lifts, hoists and cranes along with big-screen TV, Keg holder/chiller, BBQ grill with hood so it can be used inside when it's raining, a couple of couches and some video games. I have to admit, my garage is carpeted and it is much nicer to wrench on the Morgan while laying on a carpet. Some examples:

I like the last one best.

Keg coolers in the shop? One wonders about the accident rate of "lemme just finish this beer before firing up the table saw..."

Not a problem. That a show garage, not a place where saws and other nefarious tools can mess things up. Now the garage where I stripped an old Porsche (a real air cooled one) down to bare steel (and plenty of iron oxide for that hi carbon body) was a real garage.

[Olaf Hart]

I understand shop no 2 if you are running an RSR.

You need that hoist just to change the plugs.

Must admit, I painted the slab of my shop before I rebuilt my old 356 Super 90.

Felt like a real Porsche garage.

[Tim OConnell]

Techshop -- it that the outfit that Michael M. has been telling me about? It sounds like fun, but agree about the sustainability question.

I've really turned around on the whole "Make" movement. At first I was completely underwhelmed -- it seemed like the kind of stuff I was doing in Junior High, only now by adults. Pretty amateurish, most of it.

But eventually I realized that it didn't matter. It is great that people, any people, any age, are teaching themselves how to build things. We have an entire generation or two who are passive technology consumers, and anything that gets people to try creating for themselves is great. Some of the Makers are doing sophisticated, interesting things, and even the ones who are just now learning how to switch a LED on and off are taking a big step. I honestly think that knowing how to create, rather than just consume, is a huge benefit to all of us. And, it's fun.

Yes, I know that there are many ways to create -- creation doesn't have to physically manifest itself in nuts and bolts and wires and solder. But physical interaction with our world is important.

Exactly my thoughts too Paul.

[Soñadora]

I understand shop no 2 if you are running an RSR.

You need that hoist just to change the plugs.

Must admit, I painted the slab of my shop before I rebuilt my old 356 Super 90.

Felt like a real Porsche garage.

I'm pretty sure they photoshopped the oils stains off the floor.

[BeauV]

We once painted the floor of a workshop chocolate brown so that the stains wouldn't show. Great idea until it got wet. It was slipperier than whales snot.

[JoeP]

I'm just not going to ask how you know the slipperiness of whale snot.

[Cherie320]

That first picture seems to be a waste of a good garage, until you notice the fine tool box on the right - tool envy yes. The next one just looks like the making of a crisis with SWMBO 1) if you can keep the garage that clean why not the house....2) you said Porshes were reliable, why do you have to work on it?....3) and then there is the killer - just where did you plan for me to park my car? Now that last picture really works. The wood gives off a warm feeling, you can smell the coffee brewing and feel the tools in your hand. Quite nice! Pat

[JoeP]

Sometimes I dream of a garage that looks like this:

cobb3_lg[1].jpg

[Soñadora]

Joe, but you DO have a shop like that, don't you?

It's just that someone else owns it!

[kimbottles]

Joe, but you DO have a shop like that, don't you?

It's just that someone else owns it!

I have been in his shop and it is WAY bigger than the one in the picture.

If we filled it with 11 feet of water the Sliver could sail inside his shop!