When something is "free", it often isn't

[BeauV]

There is a well written piece in the NY Times Sunday Magazine today titled: "Big Tech's War on Privacy"

(Note: The title on-line is a little different from the paper issue; I've used the title from the paper version.)

What I find fascinating is that many folks have thought that Google and Facebook, in particular, are "free". Meaning that they don't have to pay money to use an immensely expensive tool/service. I think that most of us here believe that there is a "cost" of that "free" offering, but this article lays out the details of exactly what it is costing those of us who use these tools.

I'm often asked why I don't use Google Aps, search engine, and maps. The answer is really quite simple. Apple, who provides alternatives to all of these, expressly does NOT make money selling my information to others. Indeed, they help people keep things much more private; yes, even the maps, and to a lesser extent the search requests through Bing.

So the question I have for the group is: Is the cost of this "free" service/tool worth the value delivered?

[kdh]

I just discovered that google allows logging in while using Safari on the iphone, and somehow I was.

I assume that whenever I'm logged into google I'm being tracked, and I'm not being tracked when I'm logged off, but I might be wrong. Google knows about my google account on my phone, as it presents it when nagging me about logging in.

[BeauV]

I just discovered that google allows logging in while using Safari on the iphone, and somehow I was.

I assume that whenever I'm logged into google I'm being tracked, and I'm not being tracked when I'm logged off, but I might be wrong. Google knows about my google account on my phone, as it presents it when nagging me about logging in.

Yes, and to do the 2-factor authentication (where you have to respond on your phone in order to log in on the web browser) they use the phone. What this means is that you have to run not only the Google Search from within Safari but also the Google iPhone App. It was this final straw that got me off them. Their App is gone (because it uses the GPS regardless of what they tell you), their search engine is gone, I only use YouTube from a computer, so that it can't track where I am on the phone, etc... etc... etc....

I really do think that Apple is much better about this. But none of them are perfect.

BTW, while mentioning 2-factor authentication. I would HIGHLY recommend doing 2-factor whenever possible. While it's pretty easy to steal a password it is much more difficult to steal the password and also be able to respond to the challenge on another device. The Apple face and finger recognition stuff is another 2-factor technique which is acceptable in my mind.

[LarryHoward]

Agree on two factor but discovered a hitch. I spend a fair amount of time in SCIFs where personal electronics are not permitted. I do have a dedicated laptop without wireless that was scanned when new and lives in the SCIF that has internet access. Two factor doesn’t work well when you can’t get the second device code if you are set up for text. Some sites will allow use of security questions to confirm identity which isn’t quite as secure but helps.

[Orestes Munn]

Whoa, wait; you use access personal stuff on a "clean" computer from a SCIF?

All of our gov't electronics are continually scanned whenever they are detected by the mother ship, whether they're on the VPN or not.

[LarryHoward]

Whoa, wait; you use access personal stuff on a "clean" computer from a SCIF?

All of our gov't electronics are continually scanned whenever they are detected by the mother ship, whether they're on the VPN or not.

Not on Government electronics and not on a DOD network. Company owned and provided computer on a separate "unclassified" connection that is isolated from the DOD network. We have to research tech stuff, reach back into our company servers (with a VPN) and access company email and employee timekeeping through a web server. Government monitors the connection (it is the "contractor" line on the base) and the biggest issue has been USG folks plugging in personal devices (not all connections are inside SCIFs) and downloading copyrighted movies, etc. during lunch breaks.

All authorized and connection provided by USG IT security folks. I do not access my online banking from that computer.

[BeauV]

Larry, your problems is very well known to me. That's why I was thrilled when Apple started to support a second-factor like my finger or face. I only wish the darned computers camera was good enough for the face recognition.

[Orestes Munn]

I do not access my online banking from that computer.

Heh, I bet.

I have no idea what they actually scan. I have all kinds of personal crap on my gov't iPhone, and my desktop, but I'm a little more careful with the laptops. On the other hand, none of these machines are considered clean and there is no explicit "no personal crap" policy.

[Ajax]

Larry, your problems is very well known to me. That's why I was thrilled when Apple started to support a second-factor like my finger or face. I only wish the darned computers camera was good enough for the face recognition.

You trust Apple not to share your biometric information with anyone, gov't included?

[Orestes Munn]

Larry, your problems is very well known to me. That's why I was thrilled when Apple started to support a second-factor like my finger or face. I only wish the darned computers camera was good enough for the face recognition.

You trust Apple not to share your biometric information with anyone, gov't included?

They've played it fairly tough when the FBI has wanted iPhones unlocked and, unlike Google, their primary business is not the aggregation and sale of personal info.

The harm aspect is the hardest piece for me to sort out. Obviously, Panopticon organizations can and do cause big harms to society, but other than having ads chase me around the internet, the personal harm from I am likely to sustain from Google's dossier on me seems very small in relation to the convenience of their little traps. Under those conditions, it's hard to summon the gumption to stop playing.

[SemiSalt]

Chrome on my Samsung tablet has a problem. I can't input text on most forum-type sites, like this one. It acts like the <textarea> doesn't accept focus. I'm waiting for a Chrome update to see if that fixes it because the only alternative that I can think of is to delete and reinstall Chrome, and that means a pretty tedious week of dealing with passwords that I don't remember, probably having to reset them via "forgotten password" protocols, and propagating the new PWs to three, maybe even four devices. So, for the time being, I run to the Windows machine to make posts like this one.

Here is the more relevant part: I thought maybe I'd try to log out of Google on the tablet to see if that made a difference. When I asked how to do that, I found the instruction to "delete the Google account". That really suggests how tightly Google is binding the users.

[Ajax]

Semi- My Samsung tablet does exactly the same thing. Since we both have this problem, I'd wait for a Chrome update to see if that fixes it.

[SemiSalt]

Semi- My Samsung tablet does exactly the same thing. Since we both have this problem, I'd wait for a Chrome update to see if that fixes it.

That's very interesting. My Googling has not brought up any evidence that it's a wide-spread problem.

Edit: My wife, clever woman, notes that we have Scantlings and Sailing Anarchy in common......