How to use your EV...

[avramd]

As promised, I thought I would start a separate thread for more specific discussion on owning & using EV's, b/c I feel like I majorly hijacked the EV prediction thread to mostly get advice from Beau regarding my new Tesla.

Hopefully Beau actually shows up to this thread, although it'd be pretty funny if he didn't

First question - what are good resources for researching detailed/specific topics regarding Teslas? My first major project is that I would like to get a decent set of 18" alloy wheels for my Model Y to put snow tires on. It is only sold with 19" or larger wheels, but I believe I read somewhere that 18's can fit.

In particular, I'd like to know what if there are any specific specs I can go by, any other gotchas I need to be aware of, and what to do about outfitting them to participate in the tire pressure monitoring system.

[Jamie]

How did the car handle the US1 segment of your trip?

You might check Tirerack for non OE fitment.

https://www.willtheyfit.com/

This will recalculate the size, offset and OD, but you must measure clearance off the perches and brakes yourself

[LarryHoward]

There are also a growing number of Tesla specialty shops, mostly in California but they can probably give you some options in figment and tires to meet you needs. As Jaime says, when you deviate from factory, there is a risk of interference that you have to assume. Gone through it many times with sports cars trying to get just a bit more “stick.”

Interestingly, I read last night the the 2021 Taycan got a 10% bump in EPA mileage. Porsche is very conservative and was using the 21” aggressive tires and turbo wheels in their calcs. They are releasing the 2 WD variant with less aggressive wheels and tires now and the 2wd and 4wd are measured with those. Only the “turbo” will come stock with the aggressive wheels and tires. Little things really count with electric range. In the wild, Taycans generally exceed their range estimates unless driven like a Porsche while many folks seem to have a hard time getting full EPA range from a Tesla. That said, Tesla has a huge head start on refining batteries, controllers, etc on the rest of the field.

[BeauV]

Hi, I'm here.

Regarding different wheels, the posts above all work. I'd just hang out on some of the forums asking questions - there are many. A large number of people have put different wheels on Teslas, heck something like 80% of pick-up truck owners put after market wheels on them. It's a big industry. Everything Larry and Jamie have said makes sense to me.

Regarding range, here's some real-world measured data. As you know I drive from Santa Cruz to San Francisco about once a week, and I used to do it about 3 times a week. I always run the same route and the only variables are speed. I use the same car, Model S P85D, which has the largest rims and widest tires Tesla will accept. The distance is 77 miles according to Google Maps, my odometer says it is 79 miles. (Edit: I toss the results which were measured during rainstorms. Plowing through the water on the road reduces milage/range by at least 15%)

Amount of charge remaining with different speed settings for the Autopilot:
65 MPH - 23%
70 MPH - 21%
75 MPH - 17%
80 MPH - 12%
85 MPH - 7%

The Model S is a slippery car (CD=0.23), but it's clear that wind drag is the big issue here. Rolling resistance to the wide aggressive tires is also an issue. But, I don't have a second set of tires so no data.

I have driven the same car along Highway US 5 to Los Angeles. The outside air temp can vary a LOT. I don't have enough samples to be really accurate, but when the outside air is over 102°F, I get about 25% lower range when compared to outside air at under 65°F. This is because the AC is running hard inside the car, but more importantly the Tesla sounds like a freaking hovercraft blowing air through the battery cooling system. The Various EPA tests are done at what we'd consider room temperature. Your real life range will vary a lot when the air temp gets below freezing, because battery power will be used to heat the batteries and the cab, and as above in high temps.

In response to Larry's comment about not getting to the EPA numbers, I can easily match the EPA numbers by using autopilot and not driving like an idiot when I'm in control. While you recapture power with regenerative braking, you lose at least 30%. So driving any EV the way I used to drive my 996 Turbo Porsche you'll be disappointed with the range. BTW, the 996 Turbo (CD=0.31) used to get 22 MPH on autopilot at 70 MPH, but what's the fun in that!??! On a drive across central Nevada on route 50 I once set a terrible mileage record of 4 MPG at a sustained speed of 160 MPH. So, it isn't just EVs that fail to meet their EPA numbers when driven in a way the EPA doesn't measure.

[Jamie]

Heavy rims are a sin against angular momentum.

[BeauV]

Heavy rims are a sin against angular momentum.

It's interesting to consider the trade off between metal and rubber. Assuming the OD is the same, then the choice is how much of the distance between the axel and the road do you span with the rim and how much with the sidewalls? Given metal is so much stronger in compression than rubber, I'd guess a low profile tire with a larger rim was lighter than a high profile tire with a smaller rim. Or, are you saying that the OD is not the same? In the case of the Tesla-S if the OD were much smaller I'd be dragging the batteries on the ground, I've only got 4" of ground clearance.

Of course, my numbers are from freeway driving. If one is accelerating and decelerating the tires+rims, that uses a heap of energy if the rim+tire weight is excessive.

Here's a question I asked my 8-year old grand daughter and then coached her on how to think about the answer: "If the tire of a car doesn't slid on the pavement, then it must be standing still, right?" she says "yes". The tires are squealing when the cars are passing us on the road so the bottom of their tires must be standing still on the ground at the bottom, right?" ... ... ... long pause ... ... ... "Yes, I guess so." she replies. "But, we know the car is going 25 miles per hour, right?" "Yes!" she says with certainty because we'd just been discussing it. "Then how fast is the top of the tire going? We know the bottom is standing still, and the center where the axel is going 25 miles per hour because it's going the same speed as the car. So, how fast is the top of the tire going? ... ... ... another long pause ... ... "Fast!" she finally exclaims. "But how fast?" "Twice?" she guesses. I applaud and give her a big hug and we wonder along on our walk talking about stuff like that. Grand kids are great! We'll do the geometry later.

[avramd]

I only used the autopilot a little bit on Rt 1, it wasn't pleasant. Driving wise the car was fine, it's a little harsher of a ride than my Outback was, but that's to be expected with the tighter suspension. One thing that surprised me is that despite having 19" wheels, these tires are only slightly lower profile than the Outback's - 45 vs 50 (I think).

I did have a very uncomfortable experience on the way home on Rt 1 where heavy flurries accumulated enough to wet the road. At one point things just felt "odd," and my immediate guess was that an extremely refined stability control and antilock brake system was quietly and quickly "tick-tick-ticking" away. It was funky activating ABS simply by lifting off of the accelerator slightly, but that makes perfect sense given that the regenerative braking system is so aggressive.

I quickly tested the steering and surmised that I had approximately 5% of normal traction at the moment. At 55 mph it took me about 10 seconds to slow to 45 mph. Fortunately all this happened on a dead straightaway. If I had needed to avoid an obstacle, we'd be having a different conversation right now. For the next 30 mins I paid close attention to the road color, and drove 10 under the limit any time it looked wet. My Y does have all-weather tires. This is definitely one the biggest traction deficits I've ever experienced and in the seemingly mildest case of winter conditions. What I can't possibly know is whether this was a random freak outlier event in which black ice formed right in front of me in extremely mild light snow in a way I've never seen before, and any car without studs would have behaved the same - or if this was more emblematic of this being a very heavy car, and all weather tires really just aren't good enough for any normal winter conditions. I don't really care b/c I intended to put studs on it all along, this just means I do it earlier than originally planned.

[avramd]

Beau,

Do you have any specific forums you recommend based on either the quality of posts/people or effectiveness of search functionality? I've only found http://forums.tesla.com so far, and so far I can not see a way to limit searches to specific topics. Although there is a Model Y topic, searching there seems to search the entire site.

Also, I'd love any advice you have on home chargers. I've heard some people say they wish the didn't get the Tesla home charger. The ChargePoint Home Flex sells for $700 and is supposedly good for up to 50mph charging if you give it a 50 amp circuit. It looks like it comes with a nice smartphone app and reporting feature. And obviously this is a great topic to research on forums too, so :+1 for the above question

[Jamie]

Heavy rims are a sin against angular momentum.

It's interesting to consider the trade off between metal and rubber. Assuming the OD is the same, then the choice is how much of the distance between the axel and the road do you span with the rim and how much with the sidewalls? Given metal is so much stronger in compression than rubber, I'd guess a low profile tire with a larger rim was lighter than a high profile tire with a smaller rim. Or, are you saying that the OD is not the same? In the case of the Tesla-S if the OD were much smaller I'd be dragging the batteries on the ground, I've only got 4" of ground clearance.

Of course, my numbers are from freeway driving. If one is accelerating and decelerating the tires+rims, that uses a heap of energy if the rim+tire weight is excessive.

Here's a question I asked my 8-year old grand daughter and then coached her on how to think about the answer: "If the tire of a car doesn't slid on the pavement, then it must be standing still, right?" she says "yes". The tires are squealing when the cars are passing us on the road so the bottom of their tires must be standing still on the ground at the bottom, right?" ... ... ... long pause ... ... ... "Yes, I guess so." she replies. "But, we know the car is going 25 miles per hour, right?" "Yes!" she says with certainty because we'd just been discussing it. "Then how fast is the top of the tire going? We know the bottom is standing still, and the center where the axel is going 25 miles per hour because it's going the same speed as the car. So, how fast is the top of the tire going? ... ... ... another long pause ... ... "Fast!" she finally exclaims. "But how fast?" "Twice?" she guesses. I applaud and give her a big hug and we wonder along on our walk talking about stuff like that. Grand kids are great! We'll do the geometry later.

Unless made out of exotic materials like carbon, most times the larger diameter rims will weigh more than than a smaller rim with a larger sidewall tire and and more of the weight will be placed on the outside of a larger diameter rim, the worse place to have it. Think of it like weight higher and higher aloft. Tire walls also get heavier with lower profile tires. You'll notice few mfg of aftermarket rims will list the weight of their rims because most rims, especially OE rims, are made for fashion and to a cost point. Other than appearance, larger diameter rims for the same OD and width are more about getting rid of tire flex.

The next brain teaser is that while the relative speed is different, the rotational speed of the tire itself is constant. I remember having a long conversation with my son about that.

[Panope]

Regarding rim/tire height ratio, would it be correct to assume that the selection made by the Formula 1 racers would be a good choice for street drivers as well?

Note: Formula 1 wheel and tires are not what I would call "low profile".

[BeauV]

Beau,

Do you have any specific forums you recommend based on either the quality of posts/people or effectiveness of search functionality? I've only found http://forums.tesla.com so far, and so far I can not see a way to limit searches to specific topics. Although there is a Model Y topic, searching there seems to search the entire site.

Also, I'd love any advice you have on home chargers. I've heard some people say they wish the didn't get the Tesla home charger. The ChargePoint Home Flex sells for $700 and is supposedly good for up to 50mph charging if you give it a 50 amp circuit. It looks like it comes with a nice smartphone app and reporting feature. And obviously this is a great topic to research on forums too, so :+1 for the above question

We bought the Tesla home charger and it has worked fine for five years. We only give the cars 40amps out of the 200amp service we have at the house, primarily to avoid overload & low-voltage elsewhere. I haven't ever heard anything about problems with the Tesla home charger. Charging rate is not maximized in any of the home applications I've seen as the car itself monitors the incoming voltage. The car will draw down on the 240vAC and watch the voltage. At some limit set by Tesla, it will back off on the current flow to avoid a brownout in the home. If you want to give the car 50amps, you'd better have a BIG power line. Occasionally, despite our 200amp service, I find that the Model-X is only pulling 25amps because the neighborhood and our house is running at lower than spec. voltage. You may pay for a "high performance charger" but never get to use it due to local voltages and the safety stuff programmed into the car.

The Tesla App is well worth using. It tells you what's going on with the charging, you can set your charge limits etc... from your phone, and it will remind you that you've done things like leave the tailgate/trunk/door/window open. All of which I've done. It also lets you keep track of service appointments etc...

The only thing the T-App doesn't do it let me enter my various billing rates for mid-day, afternoon, evening etc.... That way it could read out in $$s what I was paying to charge the car. But I've just built a spreadsheet to do that for me. Also, the obviously answer is always to recharge between mid-night at 7am, as we get about a 50% discount on electrical power during those hours.

[Jamie]

Regarding rim/tire height ratio, would it be correct to assume that the selection made by the Formula 1 racers would be a good choice for street drivers as well?

Note: Formula 1 wheel and tires are not what I would call "low profile".

That's rule regulated and those sidewalls are so stiff they might as well be metal. No ride considerations needed.

I'd say horses for courses. I'm very happy with our Jeep Grand Cherokee's 265/60-R18 tires. That's a big wheel with lots of squishy sidewall for comfy cruising and occasional curb climbing. Not so great for cornering or steering feel.

My STi has 245/40-R18. Much smaller tire (profile is a ratio), same diameter rim, much lower profile. Good for a small light-ish street car. You'll notice the 0-60 times for the STi dropped by over a second when they switched from an 18" rim to a 19" rim in 2020 because it looked cooler. It was an addition of only about 1KG per corner including the tire. Unsprung weight is a big deal. Small changes make for yuge differences in your suspension and acceleration. I'm not a huge fan of low profile tires. I have curbed 2 of 4 rims . If I were going to add a bigger turbo and more power, I might switch to a 9" rim with a different offset (position of the hub relative to the rim of the wheel) like I had on my LGT wagon. If I were racing I'd get smaller 17" rims and race tires. My winter set is 215/50-R17. Perfect for scoobi-donuts in the parking lot and deep snow.

There are real racers on this website so I'll try not to get ahead of myself.

[LarryHoward]

Real thread drift but low profile give less “squirm” and are much stiffer. Big difference in precision, response and turn in. f-1 tires have lots of compliance and actually make up much of the springing of the suspension. Also run very low pressure to the point that there are minimum cold pressures mandated on the grid as there is a benefit to lower hot pressure.

In 22 (21 before COVID) F-1 is going to larger wheels and lower profile tires. A big challenge to the suspension and chassis engineers to get that right as tires will get harder requiring softer springs and more dynamic control. F—1 is no longer anything of an open development class. Very tight regulations around some basic concepts.

[BeauV]

I only used the autopilot a little bit on Rt 1, it wasn't pleasant. Driving wise the car was fine, it's a little harsher of a ride than my Outback was, but that's to be expected with the tighter suspension. One thing that surprised me is that despite having 19" wheels, these tires are only slightly lower profile than the Outback's - 45 vs 50 (I think).

I did have a very uncomfortable experience on the way home on Rt 1 where heavy flurries accumulated enough to wet the road. At one point things just felt "odd," and my immediate guess was that an extremely refined stability control and antilock brake system was quietly and quickly "tick-tick-ticking" away. It was funky activating ABS simply by lifting off of the accelerator slightly, but that makes perfect sense given that the regenerative braking system is so aggressive.

I quickly tested the steering and surmised that I had approximately 5% of normal traction at the moment. At 55 mph it took me about 10 seconds to slow to 45 mph. Fortunately all this happened on a dead straightaway. If I had needed to avoid an obstacle, we'd be having a different conversation right now. For the next 30 mins I paid close attention to the road color, and drove 10 under the limit any time it looked wet. My Y does have all-weather tires. This is definitely one the biggest traction deficits I've ever experienced and in the seemingly mildest case of winter conditions. What I can't possibly know is whether this was a random freak outlier event in which black ice formed right in front of me in extremely mild light snow in a way I've never seen before, and any car without studs would have behaved the same - or if this was more emblematic of this being a very heavy car, and all weather tires really just aren't good enough for any normal winter conditions. I don't really care b/c I intended to put studs on it all along, this just means I do it earlier than originally planned.

Two comments:

First, I'm really sorry I didn't warn you about the amount of regenerative braking the car applies. We ALWAYS turn off regenerative braking in the snow. I want to be the one in control of ALL braking - period. I'm not certain that the Tesla uses all four wheels for regenerative braking, it may only use the front two, at least that's the way it felt the first time I drove the X in snow. That, obviously, would make the feeling of a lack of control much worse. There is a section in the manual about driving in snow, take a look at the various traction control settings etc... It's worth reading.

Second, while the Model-Y is heavy (4,400 lbs) compared to a compact car, it isn't all that heavy. It's running on 255 sized tires (I think). So, one can compare it to a car like the BMW 520 which runs on 545 sized tires and weighs 3,737 lbs, or the MBZ e500 which runs on 245 sized tires and weighs 3,800 lbs. Then there is the Ford Explorer that weighs 4,300 lbs and runs on 255 sized tires. I don't think the tire size and weight are the issue, but I could be wrong. A lot of folks think the Model 3 and Y are "mid sized or small cars", but they're really comparable to the BMW and MBZ sedans for interior space etc...

To conclude, I think once you get the regenerative braking turned off you'll be a much happier guy in snow and ice. Frankly, I turn off both regenerative braking and traction control in those conditions, as there are some times in snow when these things make matters worse. You can read how to do this HERE But, and this is a BIG BUT!, I would NOT DO THIS unless you're trying to get through extremely conditions. A Tesla has so much torque that with traction control off you can literally smolder a tire if it happens to be sitting on a patch of slippery stuff, like paint in a cross walk. (I can tell you how I know it if you like )

Please be sure to read about ABS on the Tesla Website if you haven't had an ABS equipped car. When the Tesla goes into ABS the shaking is significant, like you're on gravel, but the thing stops gangbusters. The shaking is what the ABS is supposed to do. Forum Posts Here

Finally, I think once you get the regenerative braking turned off, you'll be much more comfortable in snow.

[avramd]

Hey Beau,

Thanks for the links - I've got my homework cut out for me!

First, you definitely don't owe me an apology - obviously of course b/c what happens to me isn't your responsibility - but more specifically, b/c I don't really think this was an issue in my case. While it would be a great win if you are right and the regen is asymmetric, the reality is that I was not out of control, I just had extremely limited traction. But, even more specific than that, this happened when I would not have considered myself to be even in "moderate," much less "extreme" winter conditions. In other words, even having read your post, I wouldn't have thought your advice applicable in the conditions I was in. The accumulation was zero.

Regarding the torque, it had occurred to me that in actual winter conditions, I might put the car into "chill mode." The Model Y also has an "off road" setting. I haven't read your links yet, but it seems like this is a setting that assumes slip is normal, and to be allowed and coordinated, not avoided.

I've ordered a set of 18" alloys from Tire Rack. I've found several local suppliers that can get me studded Nokian Hakkapeliitta 9's at an ok price. The size available is 245/50x18. The stock wheel/tire on the MY is 255/45x19. So I'm taking on 1cm narrower and 0.5cm shorter/less ground clearance. I'm still figuring out what to do about the TPMS (tire pressure monitoring system), apparently the Model Y has a proprietary bluetooth system, and the units for the S/X/3 don't work for it.

[LarryHoward]

Real thread drift but low profile give less “squirm” and are much stiffer. Big difference in precision, response and turn in. f-1 tires have lots of compliance and actually make up much of the springing of the suspension. Also run very low pressure to the point that there are minimum cold pressures mandated on the grid as there is a benefit to lower hot pressure.

In 22 (21 before COVID) F-1 is going to larger wheels and lower profile tires. A big challenge to the suspension and chassis engineers to get that right as tires will get harder requiring softer springs and more dynamic control. F—1 is no longer anything of an open development class. Very tight regulations around some basic concepts.

I’ll stop now. Reading this morning that FIA has approved using 2021 cars for testing of the larger wheels. They are going from 13” to 18” wheels in 22. A massive change in wheel/tire stiffness and response.

[SemiSalt]

Amount of charge remaining with different speed settings for the Autopilot:
65 MPH - 23%
70 MPH - 21%
75 MPH - 17%
80 MPH - 12%
85 MPH - 7%

This table reminds me of something from the gas shortages back in the 1970s. I had a financial advisor who lived and had his office in NYC, and also a vacation house in Essex, CT. In one of our conferences, we discussed shortages and fuel economy, as everyone was doing, and he said that his diesel Mercedes got great fuel economy on a trip from NYC to Essex at 45 mph. Only John B. could stand to drive the approx 115 miles, mostly on Rte 95, the CT Tpke, at 45 mph.

[BeauV]

Amount of charge remaining with different speed settings for the Autopilot:
65 MPH - 23%
70 MPH - 21%
75 MPH - 17%
80 MPH - 12%
85 MPH - 7%

This table reminds me of something from the gas shortages back in the 1970s. I had a financial advisor who lived and had his office in NYC, and also a vacation house in Essex, CT. In one of our conferences, we discussed shortages and fuel economy, as everyone was doing, and he said that his diesel Mercedes got great fuel economy on a trip from NYC to Essex at 45 mph. Only John B. could stand to drive the approx 115 miles, mostly on Rte 95, the CT Tpke, at 45 mph.

Semi - that's a great story!! The _AVERAGE_ speed on I-280 going to and from San Francisco is 80 MPH. If I set the autopilot on 75, I have to move over the the second lane from the right. The two times I set it on 65 I was in the slow lane and go honked at. The official speed limit is 55 MPH.

Many decades ago my x-wife and I went to see Bill Cosby live at a venue in San Jose. It turns out that he was staying in San Francisco and someone had driven him down 280 to the performance. They went 80 MPH ++. Cosby announced to the audience as he came on stage: "I can't believe it! I just CAN'T BELIEVE IT!! Don't the police know about 280???" He proceeded to do a hysterical bit for 15 minutes on how amazing it was to zoom down the road at 80 MPH door nob to door nob with all those other cars, "as if it was NORMAL!" I was crying it was so funny.

[Panope]

It's amazing how quickly one acclimates to high speed. On a drive between Frankfurt and Munich, I soon relaxed in 125 MPH (200 KPH) traffic. When the traffic slowed down to 100 MPH, it felt like we were crawling. 60 felt like a complete waste of time.

Steve

[kimbottles]

It's amazing how quickly one acclimates to high speed. On a drive between Frankfurt and Munich, I soon relaxed in 125 MPH (200 KPH) traffic. When the traffic slowed down to 100 MPH, it felt like we were crawling. 60 felt like a complete waste of time.

Steve

That was my experience driving in Germany too. I would fire wall the throttle and try to watch for the Benz or Audi coming up fast behind me. About 130 was as fast as I could get the rental car to go. Once we crossed the border into Denmark I had to really pull back, the Danish police took a dim view of German drivers.

[Jamie]

Nowadays there is often so much construction and traffic that 120kph limitations are frequent and the penalties stiff.

[Panope]

It's amazing how quickly one acclimates to high speed. On a drive between Frankfurt and Munich, I soon relaxed in 125 MPH (200 KPH) traffic. When the traffic slowed down to 100 MPH, it felt like we were crawling. 60 felt like a complete waste of time.

Steve

That was my experience driving in Germany too. I would fire wall the throttle and try to watch for the Benz or Audi coming up fast behind me. About 130 was as fast as I could get the rental car to go. Once we crossed the border into Denmark I had to really pull back, the Danish police took a dim view of German drivers.

130 mph limit for rental cars might be "a thing". The rented Benz that I had hit the rev limiter at same.

[Ken Heaton (Salazar)]

A few years ago, on a trip up to Ontario to visit my Dad ( about 4,000 km. round trip ) I had the cruise control on the Golf set to 100 mph (160 km/hr.) and Anne kept giving me dirty looks from the passenger seat. I pointed out there were people passing us occasionally, and we weren't passing that many. At some point I asked her to take over as I needed a bit of a break. I settled in and closed my eyes for a wee rest. After a bit I sneaked a peek at the speedo. it was pegged at 160 km.

Mission accomplished.

[H B]

A few years ago, on a trip up to Ontario to visit my Dad ( about 4,000 km. round trip ) I had the cruise control on the Golf set to 100 mph (160 km/hr.) and Anne kept giving me dirty looks from the passenger seat. I pointed out there were people passing us occasionally, and we weren't passing that many. At some point I asked her to take over as I needed a bit of a break. I settled in and closed my eyes for a wee rest. After a bit I sneaked a peek at the speedo. it was pegged at 160 km.

Mission accomplished.

You always want to be the 2nd fastest car on the road, and avoid being in the 'front' of the fast pack.

[BeauV]

A few years ago, on a trip up to Ontario to visit my Dad ( about 4,000 km. round trip ) I had the cruise control on the Golf set to 100 mph (160 km/hr.) and Anne kept giving me dirty looks from the passenger seat. I pointed out there were people passing us occasionally, and we weren't passing that many. At some point I asked her to take over as I needed a bit of a break. I settled in and closed my eyes for a wee rest. After a bit I sneaked a peek at the speedo. it was pegged at 160 km.

Mission accomplished.

You always want to be the 2nd fastest car on the road, and avoid being in the 'front' of the fast pack.

I speak from experience when I say that being "first" is a bad idea in areas where RADAR is used. But, being "last" in a really fast group is bad in an area where the copy is trying to catch up (slow cop cars), and they are usually pissed off at not being able to corral everyone. Middle of the pack fails miserably when the chase car calls a "helper", having once pulled up to a roadblock on CA-395 along with five other cars..... "Gentlemen, turn off your engines, remain in your cars, and don't dare complain. You're going to be here a long time." (From the CA Highway patrol)

One of my favorite quotes: "You can outrun my Dodge Police Special, but you can't outrun my Motorola."

[kimbottles]

A few years ago, on a trip up to Ontario to visit my Dad ( about 4,000 km. round trip ) I had the cruise control on the Golf set to 100 mph (160 km/hr.) and Anne kept giving me dirty looks from the passenger seat. I pointed out there were people passing us occasionally, and we weren't passing that many. At some point I asked her to take over as I needed a bit of a break. I settled in and closed my eyes for a wee rest. After a bit I sneaked a peek at the speedo. it was pegged at 160 km.

Mission accomplished.

You always want to be the 2nd fastest car on the road, and avoid being in the 'front' of the fast pack.

I speak from experience when I say that being "first" is a bad idea in areas where RADAR is used. But, being "last" in a really fast group is bad in an area where the copy is trying to catch up (slow cop cars), and they are usually pissed off at not being able to corral everyone. Middle of the pack fails miserably when the chase car calls a "helper", having once pulled up to a roadblock on CA-395 along with five other cars..... "Gentlemen, turn off your engines, remain in your cars, and don't dare complain. You're going to be here a long time." (From the CA Highway patrol)

One of my favorite quotes: "You can outrun my Dodge Police Special, but you can't outrun my Motorola."

Son Brent was pulled over in my Saab Turbo once on I-5 south of Redding, CA and the CHP guy’s first words were: “Hi there flight commander, are you taking off or landing?” At least he was cheerful.

[LarryHoward]

A few years ago, on a trip up to Ontario to visit my Dad ( about 4,000 km. round trip ) I had the cruise control on the Golf set to 100 mph (160 km/hr.) and Anne kept giving me dirty looks from the passenger seat. I pointed out there were people passing us occasionally, and we weren't passing that many. At some point I asked her to take over as I needed a bit of a break. I settled in and closed my eyes for a wee rest. After a bit I sneaked a peek at the speedo. it was pegged at 160 km.

Mission accomplished.

You always want to be the 2nd fastest car on the road, and avoid being in the 'front' of the fast pack.

I speak from experience when I say that being "first" is a bad idea in areas where RADAR is used. But, being "last" in a really fast group is bad in an area where the copy is trying to catch up (slow cop cars), and they are usually pissed off at not being able to corral everyone. Middle of the pack fails miserably when the chase car calls a "helper", having once pulled up to a roadblock on CA-395 along with five other cars..... "Gentlemen, turn off your engines, remain in your cars, and don't dare complain. You're going to be here a long time." (From the CA Highway patrol)

One of my favorite quotes: "You can outrun my Dodge Police Special, but you can't outrun my Motorola."

Depending on where on 395, that’s hardly fair. It’s hard to keep anything below triple digits when you have that much empty, straight, smooth road. The undulations north of Kramer used to upset the rental sedans a bit.

[BeauV]

A few years ago, on a trip up to Ontario to visit my Dad ( about 4,000 km. round trip ) I had the cruise control on the Golf set to 100 mph (160 km/hr.) and Anne kept giving me dirty looks from the passenger seat. I pointed out there were people passing us occasionally, and we weren't passing that many. At some point I asked her to take over as I needed a bit of a break. I settled in and closed my eyes for a wee rest. After a bit I sneaked a peek at the speedo. it was pegged at 160 km.

Mission accomplished.

You always want to be the 2nd fastest car on the road, and avoid being in the 'front' of the fast pack.

I speak from experience when I say that being "first" is a bad idea in areas where RADAR is used. But, being "last" in a really fast group is bad in an area where the copy is trying to catch up (slow cop cars), and they are usually pissed off at not being able to corral everyone. Middle of the pack fails miserably when the chase car calls a "helper", having once pulled up to a roadblock on CA-395 along with five other cars..... "Gentlemen, turn off your engines, remain in your cars, and don't dare complain. You're going to be here a long time." (From the CA Highway patrol)

One of my favorite quotes: "You can outrun my Dodge Police Special, but you can't outrun my Motorola."

Depending on where on 395, that’s hardly fair. It’s hard to keep anything below triple digits when you have that much empty, straight, smooth road. The undulations north of Kramer used to upset the rental sedans a bit.

LOL!!! You know that road well. It is right up there with Nevada 50. The drive on Nevada 50 was one of my favorite parts of the ski-trip to Jackson and Alta. I remember taking the Ford Expedition one time because I had both sons and my lovely Admiral aboard. The admiral (and the Ford) didn't like going faster than 85. Geeeeesh!!! It took hours longer! The great thing about the 996 was my short wide power skies would fit inside, roof racks don't like speed above 100.

[Jamie]

Try to find a rabbit. Stay close enough to see if they get nabbed, but far enough to avoid getting caught. Harder than it seems.

[BeauV]

Try to find a rabbit. Stay close enough to see if they get nabbed, but far enough to avoid getting caught. Harder than it seems.

Agreed!

But, if you're trying to really make a fast passage, I've find that I end up being the rabbit.

The best I've ever heard from the Nevada Police was: "We generally don't give a damn if you kill yourself in the middle of the desert. Just don't kill anyone else! But, if you drive like this near a city we will throw your ass in jail and you'll need a lawyer to get out. We have certain speeds limits within cities which require MANDITORY jail time, just like you do in California. So, slow down damnit!"

Once I got that lecture, and the associated ticket, I set way points along the route so that my phone would remind me 2 miles before each town. I didn't learn to navigate for nuthun!