Moderator: Soñadora
Olaf Hart wrote:Warning, this is a bit of a downer, it's about the difference between perception and reality.
Max was a clinical tutor when I did my medical training at Royal North Shore Hospital in the early seventies.
A great guy, a real giver, played with the Wallabies so was a demigod to all the medical students.
But there was a backstory too.
http://www.news.com.au/lifestyle/relati ... b90f9786bc
Max played over three hundred first grade rugby games as a forward, may have contributed to his problem.
Orestes Munn wrote:Olaf Hart wrote:I thought he was trying to tie the subatomic theory to objects that we can perceive.
" there are no public objects out there sitting in some pre existing space"
I think he is simplifying what quantum mechanics actually predicts.
Oh, sorry. Yes, I think that's at least in part what Hoffman is doing, inasmuch as I understand it. However, if Rob's boat and wife existed on the quantum plane, they would have a disquietingly non-zero probability of being in my slip and evil hands, respectively, as we speak.
Rob McAlpine wrote:Orestes Munn wrote:Olaf Hart wrote:I thought he was trying to tie the subatomic theory to objects that we can perceive.
" there are no public objects out there sitting in some pre existing space"
I think he is simplifying what quantum mechanics actually predicts.
Oh, sorry. Yes, I think that's at least in part what Hoffman is doing, inasmuch as I understand it. However, if Rob's boat and wife existed on the quantum plane, they would have a disquietingly non-zero probability of being in my slip and evil hands, respectively, as we speak.
I'm not sure Sparky is the sort of boat you want for the way you use a boat, she's probably a lot smaller inside than you're used to.
I need some brain bleach to wipe the mental image of Orestes "Dr. Evil" Munn with Beth.
I'm really glad that non-zero can easily be 1:10^100000000
Rob McAlpine wrote:Kim, there's the Drake Equation to calculate the probability of intelligent life. SETI has failed miserably at locating intelligent alien life possessing technology, then there's Fermi's Paradox.
To me the problem is that, unless life on earth is a case of directed panspermia (seeding by aliens), we really have only one proven occurrence of abiogenesis even on earth, from which all life here is descended, and only one case, out of billions of species which have existed on earth, of a species developing technology to release signals into space.
I think if you find one more occurrence, then we are non-unique and I'll argue that the galaxy is teeming with intelligent life. Until then, I have a hard time getting from a dead chemical soup struck by lightning to self-replicating RNA to Eine Kleine Nachtmusik and JMW Turner's Fighting Temeraire.
Jamie wrote:Why would we expect them to be communicating by radio and even if they did, expect that the radio waves would be reaching us now?
How far out is our own bubble of sub-light radio communications? 70-100 light years? We've not yet made it to the local 7-11.
BeauV wrote:Jamie wrote:Why would we expect them to be communicating by radio and even if they did, expect that the radio waves would be reaching us now?
How far out is our own bubble of sub-light radio communications? 70-100 light years? We've not yet made it to the local 7-11.
Yup!
Another interesting thought is that once we go through the sub-light radio bubble, then we went quite. Rather than TV broadcast, we run fiber cable. We are steadily reducing the energy we broadcast because we want to save energy. No reason to believe that other intelligent folks wouldn't have gone through the same process. Our transmission bubble could last 200 years and then end. The other folk's transmission bubble could have been a bit longer or shorter, but it too would probably end because broadcasting to the entire universe is wasteful.
It could also be dangerous.
Ish wrote:BeauV wrote:Jamie wrote:Why would we expect them to be communicating by radio and even if they did, expect that the radio waves would be reaching us now?
How far out is our own bubble of sub-light radio communications? 70-100 light years? We've not yet made it to the local 7-11.
Yup!
Another interesting thought is that once we go through the sub-light radio bubble, then we went quite. Rather than TV broadcast, we run fiber cable. We are steadily reducing the energy we broadcast because we want to save energy. No reason to believe that other intelligent folks wouldn't have gone through the same process. Our transmission bubble could last 200 years and then end. The other folk's transmission bubble could have been a bit longer or shorter, but it too would probably end because broadcasting to the entire universe is wasteful.
It could also be dangerous.
Any slightly more advanced species could be selling lots on Earth as vacation properties, pending removal of the savages.
kimbottles wrote:Given the vastness of the universe and the billions of galaxies (let alone Suns and Planets) there has to be life elsewhere out there somewhere. Don't know the form it would have but it has to be out there.
I like lying on my back late at night outdoors with my good binoculars and looking at all the stars I can't see with just my eyes. Really good light gathering binos really let you see the massive amount of stuff out there. And of course you are looking at the past given the amount of time light takes to get here.
I love thinking about that stuff.
Charlie wrote:kimbottles wrote:Given the vastness of the universe and the billions of galaxies (let alone Suns and Planets) there has to be life elsewhere out there somewhere. Don't know the form it would have but it has to be out there.
I like lying on my back late at night outdoors with my good binoculars and looking at all the stars I can't see with just my eyes. Really good light gathering binos really let you see the massive amount of stuff out there. And of course you are looking at the past given the amount of time light takes to get here.
I love thinking about that stuff.
I just had this exact conversation with my daughter tonight - about looking at the stars and seeing into the past. It was especially meaningful since good conversations with her are frustratingly rare these days. Anybody else ever have a 14 year old? Does it get better?
Charlie wrote:kimbottles wrote:Given the vastness of the universe and the billions of galaxies (let alone Suns and Planets) there has to be life elsewhere out there somewhere. Don't know the form it would have but it has to be out there.
I like lying on my back late at night outdoors with my good binoculars and looking at all the stars I can't see with just my eyes. Really good light gathering binos really let you see the massive amount of stuff out there. And of course you are looking at the past given the amount of time light takes to get here.
I love thinking about that stuff.
I just had this exact conversation with my daughter tonight - about looking at the stars and seeing into the past. It was especially meaningful since good conversations with her are frustratingly rare these days. Anybody else ever have a 14 year old? Does it get better?
kimbottles wrote:Given the vastness of the universe and the billions of galaxies (let alone Suns and Planets) there has to be life elsewhere out there somewhere. Don't know the form it would have but it has to be out there.
I like lying on my back late at night outdoors with my good binoculars and looking at all the stars I can't see with just my eyes. Really good light gathering binos really let you see the massive amount of stuff out there. And of course you are looking at the past given the amount of time light takes to get here.
I love thinking about that stuff.
floating dutchman wrote:Jamie, you forgot the best part of that movie!
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FkX3pD8xL8Y[/youtube]
The first time I watched one of the Lord of the Rings flicks, I saw the "Wingnuts Films Presents.." and thought "Oh fuck, here we go again!"
Yea, Peter Jackson got into a bit of hot water over the clip above, and probably should have.
Jeroen.
Tim Ford wrote:Paraphrasing Sagan, we are a way for the universe (cosmos) to know itself. I like that idea. I like being a tool. Tools are good. Enjoy the ride, watch out for trees.
Tim Ford wrote:Paraphrasing Sagan, we are a way for the universe (cosmos) to know itself. I like that idea. I like being a tool. Tools are good. Enjoy the ride, watch out for trees.
Rob McAlpine wrote: JMW Turner's Fighting Temeraire.